Joe Rogan is Stunned as Benz Reveals $35 Trillion Pentagon Black Hole [WATCH]

On a recent episode of The Joe Rogan Experience, technology and policy expert Mike Benz laid out the scale and scope of the challenge facing any administration attempting to reform the U.S. foreign policy establishment.

Benz, the founder of the Foundation for Freedom Online and a former State Department official, told host Joe Rogan that the accountability being brought to key agencies is unprecedented—and that the American people are only seeing the beginning of a decades-long battle.

“This is also, this is, it’s so deep that it makes you wonder, is there enough time in four years to unravel this stuff?” Rogan asked during the interview.

Elon Musk Called This Financial News ‘Terrifying’

“Oh, no, not four years,” Benz responded. “This is, this is a, this is a 50 year project.”

Benz explained that the entrenched bureaucracy—often referred to as “the blob”—operates with “many fractal layers” that will each resist reform.

“There are many fractal layers to this reform process, and every step of the way, there are going to be layers of resistance,” Benz said.

Still, Benz emphasized that major progress has already been made, pointing to recent reductions in federal agencies that he claims are long overdue.

American Made Patriotic Apparel – Save 15% with Promo Code MERICA

“We should spike footballs, we should pop champagne. We should do a touchdown dance on this. This is the first serious time in American history that the foreign policy establishment has had to be accountable to the people who pay for it,” Benz said.

“Even the Church Committee didn’t cause the entire shutdown of a federal agency.”

Benz then referenced the “Halloween massacre” under President Jimmy Carter, during which 30% of the U.S. intelligence workforce was laid off, and compared it to what’s happening now.

“Try what just happened with USAID, which employs, you know, a lot more people than even the CIA did… 99% went from 14,000 down to 290,” Benz said.

“This is, in every way, symbolically, operationally, financially, the hardest blow the blob has ever had to suffer in terms of accountability, and it’s only getting way deeper from here.”

“He’s only been in office for a month,” Rogan said, referencing President Donald Trump’s return to office.

“Yeah,” Benz replied. “Well, that’s why we need to create a legacy and a pipeline of people to carry on these reforms, because this is what’s coming next, right?”

Benz said President Trump has already tasked Elon Musk with investigating waste inside the Department of Defense.

“President Trump tasked Elon Musk with sicking the DOGE dogs on the Pentagon,” he said.

The size and scale of the financial waste inside the Pentagon, Benz argued, dwarfs that of other agencies.

“They have $900 billion budget, compared to only 44 billion at USAID. And even less at CIA,” Benz noted.

He pointed to publicly available reporting to back up his claims.

“Yahoo Finance… published this a couple years ago—the $35 trillion black hole. If you want to pull up that receipt on screen, just so I don’t look like I’m saying this directly myself, but just type in 35 trillion Pentagon black hole.”

“That’s larger than, you know, the entire national debt,” he added, referencing years of failed audits and missing funds.

Benz went on to offer historical context for the size and power of the modern Defense Department.

“When America was born in 1789… the first act of Congress was to create the Department of State, the Department of Treasury and the Department of War,” Benz explained.

“The Department of War became the Department of Defense in 1948.”

He warned that the recent USAID controversies are likely minor in comparison to what lies ahead.

“People even now, they’re seeing these USAID scandals, with funding to the Democrats, or funding to some of these blob, internationalist Republicans, or funding these media institutions. You ain’t seen nothing yet when you get to the Pentagon stuff,” Benz said.

“Because USAID was created effectively in part to assist Pentagon activity under humanitarian front.”

Mike Benz tells Joe Rogan we need more than 4 years for Donald Trump, Elon Musk and DOGE to take down “The Blob”

“We need to create a legacy in a pipeline of people to carry on these reforms”

Worse things are about to be discovered, DOGE is about to find at the Pentagon “A… pic.twitter.com/DbtkwJQlM8

— Wall Street Apes (@WallStreetApes) March 23, 2025

Benz concluded that meaningful reform would require not just top-level action, but a long-term commitment and a new generation prepared to continue the effort.

The opinions expressed by contributors and/or content partners are their own and do not necessarily reflect the views of LifeZette. Contact us for guidelines on submitting your own commentary.